City & Borough of Sitka, Boards & Commissions Training

Okay, should we just get going? Yeah. Okay, so welcome. Thanks everybody for joining us. I'm Melissa Henshaw, Deputy Clerk for the city, and over here we have Brian Hanson, Municipal Attorney, and on this side is Sarah Peterson.

She's Municipal Clerk. So first of all, I want to thank everybody for volunteering as a commission member. It takes a lot of work and effort and thought, and we really appreciate your hard work. So normally I would welcome interrupting questions during a presentation as such, but since we're on Zoom, I'm just going to ask that you jot down your questions and then we can answer them at the end of the presentations. So, and in the meantime, I'll ask that you also just mute if you haven't already done so.

In an email yesterday, I sent out handouts, so I just wanted to go over those. I've got this one, which is the PowerPoint presentation that I'll be going over.

The second one was a parliamentary cheat sheet of motions. So what they are, what they mean, and rules for them.

This fun colorful one was basics of parliamentary procedures.

I've got this ranking of motions. It's a slide that's in the presentation, so it's motions in what order they're allowed to be in, and you start at the bottom and work your way up.

Got contact information for the clerk's office and the legal department. We've got minutes policy, so it's helpful for those that draft the minutes for us, and a memo of more information regarding abstaining, which is also in the slides. So Okay, just figure out how to share.

Okay, welcome everybody. So a number of laws and documents govern an organization. Certain documents take priority. For instance, your charter should not be in conflict with federal and state laws. The charter supersedes the general code, so there's a hierarchy of all the rules to govern a body.

The city has 16 different various boards, commissions, committees, and task force. Most board and commissions are set by the general code and can be modified through this process. Um, Highlighted here are in the yellow are Planning Commission, Police and Fire, and the School Board. Those are in the charter, which requires a vote of the people in order to change.

I wanted to show you a couple different areas, um, on the website. This is the cityofsitka.com website. First is your commission's code. So from the main page You would click on SICA General Code under Popular Links on the right-hand side, and it takes you to the entire code. But under Title 2, Administration, you find— you can find different chapters for most of the boards and commissions.

The Climate Action Task Force that's been newly formed, for instance, though, won't be in the code. They were created by a resolution. So not everybody's in the code, but most of them are.

The second area of the website I wanted to show you is where all the board and commissions pages are. So on the right-hand side also, you click on a link for board and commissions. It takes you to this page where you can click on individual commissions that bring up rosters, previous minutes, and other information.

The Assembly assigns Assembly Liaisons each October after they've been voted into office for the new ones that come in. Some commissions have a primary and, um, and an alternate, but there's also commissions that don't have a liaison at all. So liaisons are non-voting members, but they are the communication link between the board and the Assembly, and they report to the Assembly as well.

Staff liaison serves as the communication link to administration, other departments and staff, and to the assembly. They can help to do research and develop information and assist in making recommendations for consideration.

At all regular assembly meetings, commissions have the opportunity to report about what is going on with your commission, and typically it's done by the chair of the commission or committee under the special report section. So you would just contact Sarah at the clerk's office in order to get onto the agenda for that.

Prior to holding a meeting, public notification is necessary at least 24 hours in advance. Although not required, our practice for boards and commissions have been to advertise in the newspaper, and a copy should also be sent to the Deputy Clerk so they can get posted on Facebook and also on the website. So, but if you do run into a crunch time for notification, if you're responsible for that, you just can give us a call at the Clerk's Office and we can see what we can come up with to help you out.

So we're going to cover some basics on meeting protocols that hopefully will assist you to understand proper meeting flow.

Parliamentary procedures are guidelines. So these guidelines enables a group to conduct business with fairness, consistency, and brings order to meetings by having the group consider one matter at a time. It protects the rights of everyone, also allowing the minority in a group to be heard. It maintains harmony within a group, and it helps the group make clear decisions efficiently. So hopefully you get done with your meetings faster and can get home before midnight.

Parliamentary procedure is based largely on common sense and courtesy. It seems technical because it has been necessary to develop special vocabulary for discussing it. But once you become familiar with that, the rules will be really easy. The rules are designed to help, not hinder, business that is to be conducted. So there is some leeway, especially for small boards under 12 members.

So you may find that strict enforcement of the rules just simply don't work.

So basic principles of meetings are to be prepared and start on time. In addition, parliamentary procedure exists to facilitate the transaction of business and promote cooperation. All members have equal rights, privileges, and obligations. The majority has the right to decide, and the minority has rights which must be protected. For example, the right to be heard.

A quorum must be present for the group to act. We'll get into this a little later. Free discussion of a motion is every member's right. Only one question, meaning one motion, can be considered at any given time, and members have the right to know at all times what it is and to have it restated, typically by the chair, before the vote is taken. And lastly, in debate, speak once and wait for others to have a chance.

Let's talk a little bit about the chair. An election of chair, along with vice and secretary if required, needs to take place once a year. It should be an item on the agenda and voted on by the commission. Not only does the chair set the agenda and coordinate with staff for information, it's the chair's responsibility to conduct the meeting as fair and efficient. So the chair can speak in discussion and vote on questions but tries to remain impartial, and it's best to avoid making motions.

They're the one that determines who has the right to speak and maintains order during debate. For example, keeping the discussion germane and discouraging repetition. They can allow for public comment even if there is a motion— isn't a motion on the table. And they are typically the ones to speak at assembly meetings as the official representative. An agenda gives an outline of the meeting.

This is a standard order of business for our boards and commissions. Highlighted here are agenda changes and unfinished business. So remember that agenda changes, that's.

Section is not to add any new items, but rather to move around the order if necessary. So that can be done by general consent. Unfinished business is business that was started that hasn't finished yet, or if it was on the agenda and the commission didn't get to it before the time to adjourn, it automatically gets placed onto the agenda at the next meeting.

So the first thing at a meeting is to determine before you can start, after you've gathered, is whether you have a quorum or not. It's the responsibility of the chair to determine. A quorum is the minimum number of members who must be present to legally transact business. So I'll tell you, a seat is a seat regardless of if it's filled or not, which means vacant positions are not taken into consideration for quorum requirements. Any business conducted in the absence of a quorum is null and void.

However, the fact that a meeting was called to order makes it an attempt to hold the meeting, so it fulfills requirements. Some boards and commissions have meeting— minimum meeting requirements, so that would satisfy that. The only action that can be taken is if there is a lack of a quorum. To adjourn, to recess, or to take measures such as trying to contact a member to obtain a quorum. So we've got different size boards and commissions.

9, 7, 5, And 3 are the only ones that we have. So for a 9-member board, you must have 5 members present. 7-Member board, 4 members present. A 5-member board, 3 members present. And a 3-member board 2 members present.

Once a quorum has been established, the chair calls the meeting to order, and now business can be transacted.

So we'll go over a little bit of a few motions here. We'll talk about the main motion first. Again, the chair should refrain from making a motion. The motions should state, whenever possible, who, what, when, where, and how. It should always be in the affirmative so that yes means yes and no means no.

The main motion needs to be an idea to do something or to bring business before the body. It can be made only when no other motion is pending, and you do not need to be in favor of a motion to second it. What it does, though, is it allows for conversation to ensue and allows for public comment. And the chair should restate the motion prior to voting.

A motion to amend are changes made to the original main motion. Motions to amend must be germane to the main motion. Before the motion is stated by the chair, there's the ability to modify it. The individual who seconded the motion does not need to be consulted, um, as it's meant to modify, change, improve, or perfect the motion. But often the seconder is consulted because it's the nice thing to do.

During debate, address all remarks through the chair. Don't make personal attacks. Refrain from crossbar and side conversations. It's not only distracting to other members, but it's distracting to the public as well. So make sure you are clear and don't assume.

Respect each other's views even if they're different from yours, facts are best to support your position, patience, meaning speak once and wait for others to, and although sometimes compromising isn't always fun, it is fair.

So once it looks as though all discussion has ended, the chair typically will ask if there's any further debate or discussion. And if not, now is when the chair has the opportunity to restate the motion or would ask the secretary to read back the motion. A motion is usually voted on by voice. The chair would then ask all those in favor say aye and all opposed say no. Don't forget those that may be opposed.

Sometimes that gets forgotten. The rest of the vote should be announced whether it passed The results should be announced whether it's passed or failed.

So most votes are done with a majority vote. For an item to pass a 3-member board, for instance, you need 2 votes in the affirmative, 3 ayes for a 5-member board, and so on. So here's the tricky part. Even if you have absences or vacancies at your meeting, you still need those numbers in order for an item to pass. So for example, if you have a 7-member board and you only have 4 members present, which means the quorum requirement is met, you still need an affirmative majority vote of 4 in order to pass that item.

So majority is the majority of the membership or how many seats you are required to have, not who is present at that meeting. Some motions require a two-thirds vote, which is, um, in your handouts.

So I'll also clarify that abstaining is not allowed unless excused by the remaining members for a conflict of interest, which Mr. Hanson will go over more in his presentation. Boards and commissions have historically operated under the same guidelines as the assembly, and it is stated in the charter that all members should vote unless excused by a vote of the remaining members.

Previous question is a motion. It's used to stop debate. You would state, "I move the previous question," and it ends the debate immediately. At this time, the chair would restate the motion and you would proceed with calling for a vote.

To lay on the table is one of the most misunderstood motions. Temporarily is the key here. It would be if you had some time-sensitive business to attend to and the current motion is on the floor and it's not time-sensitive, so you may want to put it aside to deal with it— to deal with a more pressing item. But you must get back to the motion that was laid on the table prior to adjournment, so it happens all within the same meeting.

If you really want to kill a motion, you would postpone indefinitely. That's the correct term. It is debatable. And it is used while a main motion is on the table. You may also want to postpone to a certain time, which would be in order if you would like to take up an agenda item at a later date.

It's important to state when the item should come back for discussion. If not stated, then it goes to the next regular meeting. So here are some other motions. Reconsider, it's wins the award for the most challenging motion. Many cities have their own rules for it, including us.

A motion can be reconsidered regardless of when the motion was made. You have to have voted on the prevailing side to reconsider and includes members not present at that particular meeting. Rescind is used to cancel something that was done at a previous meeting. Things change, we change our minds, or circumstances change and or new information could be discovered. So this is the motion that would allow you to respond to that change.

You can't rescind something when it's too late to undo, say, such as a bid has been awarded and money has been spent, then it's just too late. Amend something previously adopted is very similar to rescind. The only difference, instead of canceling the previous adopted motion, the motion changes it. So you must state your change in the motion, similar to any amendment.

If you need to take a break during a meeting, a recess is in order. It requires no objections, and you should state the length of time for the recess so that your audience knows when to expect you back at the table to resume your business.

So this slide shows two ways to adjourn, one of which is the chair. The chair can state that the meeting is adjourned, or the other, by a formal motion. Your audience and members need to know that business has been concluded and that the meeting is over. So you just don't want to just get up and leave the table, leaving your audience wondering what just happened.

So we went through most of the motions that you will ever use, but here they are and then some on this ranking slide. So this is in your handouts also, and a cheat sheet can tell you— that's in your handouts also— what they mean. The idea is to move up the ladder in what is called precedence of motions. It's when it is the time to vote on a matter, and then you come down the ladder.

Application— so other details— application for appointment or reappointment is required, and the Assembly prefers a letter of interest or resume to accompany the application.

They are ultimately the ones approving the appointments. So when a term expires, the member is notified and asked if they would like to reapply. There are no term limits. Attendance and vacancies. If you're going to be absent, please make sure to notify either the chair, staff liaison, or secretary.

If member absences become a problem, the chair should notify the clerk's office, and we'll see if we can do anything to help with that. Minutes, minutes are a record of actions. For instance, what was done, not necessarily what was said at a meeting. They are a permanent record and are kept forever. Final minutes are minutes that have been voted on as approved by the body at a public meeting.

They need to be sent back to the PERP's office and we will read, and then we in turn post them to our website, email them out to assembly members, and archive them permanently.

And then that's it for the clerk side of things. We're here for you. You've got our contact information in the handouts, and I will turn it over to Brian. Thank you, Melissa. I would also like to thank all the board and commission members that are participating today and all those who are not for volunteering for working on— are we ready?

So my name is Brian Hanson. I'm the municipal attorney. I'm in my 5th year as the municipal attorney. Um, I have been hired by the assembly at their will, but one of my duties and responsibilities for the assembly is to provide advice and counsel to the boards and commissions and the city and their members. So I'm here for you, and I appreciate what you're doing for the city.

And I want to make it abundantly clear that although I'll provide an outline and some brief discussion on some legal issues that could affect you while performing your duties, I want to make it again abundantly clear that I'm here for you. You can call me anytime if you have questions related to what I talk about today or any other thing that you think is legal that you're dealing with in the context of your board and commission. Please feel free to contact me. My phone number is— direct line is 747-1879. I think that number is on our contact sheet.

I put, um, Correll's number on there. You can put my number on there too. So let's talk about the 3 subjects that Melissa has asked me to speak to today. And first one being the Alaska Open Meetings Act. The second one would be about conflict of interest.

The third one would be about ex parte communications.

Alaska Open Meetings Act. What you need to know is that all meetings, whether by the assembly or by boards and commissions like you're involved in, are subject to state and municipal laws called the Open Meetings Act. And the Open Meetings Act is something that says essentially all meetings must, must be open to the public. And this is an important policy consideration that has been a part of government for as long as we need to know. It is important that we conduct our business in the— under the eyes and the scrutiny of our public.

So we have these laws to do this. Again, the policy is openness. It's a strong policy for leaning in favor of openness. And we have not only a state law that does that, but we have our, um, City and General Code that also has provisions that define and instruct with regard to the Open Meetings Act. Now, the first question should be, well, who does this Open Meetings Act apply to?

Um, and it, it provide— it applies to any governmental body in any public entity. So it applies to you, boards and commissions, and as we are a public entity, the municipality of the City and Borough of Sitka. So, um, what the next consideration when you're dealing with the application of the Open Meetings Act is, what is a meeting? When, when does a meeting have to be? And for, um, the assembly, it would be— the law says that if you have more than 3 people on the assembly meeting, um, then it is an Open Meeting Act that is governed by these laws.

For the boards and commissions, it involves when there is more than 3 members of them or a majority of the members then the Open Meetings Act applies. And when we're— what we're talking about meetings, we're talking about times when you as a board commission get together in person, when you get together, especially in these days and times, by teleconference or by Zoom or any other kind of virtual meeting that happens Those two are considered meetings that are governed by the Open Meetings Act. And an additional one that may not be thought of as much is that this concept of serial, serial communications creates a meeting. When I'm talking about serial communications, I'm talking about all forms of times where one per— one member of the board or commission contacts another member, and you get into a string of communications. And this can happen with emails, texts, social media, and any other type of electronic communication that creates this serial communication that turns into a meeting.

Because in the case of a, of a board or commission, 3 members or a majority of that body has communicated, again, either by an in-person meeting, a telephone conference, a virtual meeting, or a serial meeting.

So, um, what is required if you have an applicable Open Meetings Act meeting? Well, first thing is required is notice to the public that such a meeting is being held, and I'm not going to go over specifically the— all the deadlines and the requirements for notice. All you need to know is that if you're going to participate in a meeting, or if a meeting is going to be held, staff needs to know so they can properly give notice of that meeting, and they'll handle all those kind of things. I think what you'll hear from Sarah and Melissa ultimately is that if you think you're going somewhere where there's going to be a either 3 or a majority of your board or commission at that meeting and there's a potential for discussion of items, then notice must be given and you should contact the clerk's office in order for that to happen. Am I on task here?

You are, yes. Good job. Okay, all right. Now, there is a major exception to, um, when you must hold a public meeting, because holding a public meeting means that the public has the right to go to that meeting or participate in that meeting and be allowed to speak at that meeting under appropriate circumstances. And there isn't a major exception to that, is that is you conduct something that could be put into an executive session.

An executive session means that the body has the right under certain circumstances to move their meeting into private because of the subject matter of what's being discussed. The body can say, I move to go into an executive session so we can discuss these things outside of— outside of the public ear for various reasons. Now, it would be my belief that boards and commissions don't nearly have the need or the opportunity to go into executive sessions like an assembly would have too. So is this— and I'll ask the clerks right now— is this something you want me to get into any detail as far as the reasons for going to the executive session, or should we just name the reasons? Yeah, I can just name the reasons.

Okay, so let me just basically tell you when you can say, hey, let's not hold this in public, let's use the executive session.

Laws to go into private to discuss this. And these are— these things, I'll just kind of read them to what you would have to consider. If the matter would have the immediate knowledge of which would clearly have an adverse effect upon the finances of the government, that would be one. Number two would be subjects that tend to prejudice the reputation and character of any person. And that would be another reason to go into it.

The third one, matters which by law, municipal charter, ordinance, are required to be confidential. Number four, matters involving consideration of government records that by law are not subject to public disclosure, like personnel matters. And Finally, number 5, some attorney-client communications. Now what I would tell you to do is I'm not going to spend a lot of time giving you examples. I think the details here are probably not helpful.

I just think you, if you have some working knowledge that sometimes there are subjects that should be discussed in executive session. Familiarize yourself with these general reasons, and before a meeting, if you have uncertainty whether or not you should be pulling that discussion in, um, out of the general meeting, give the clerk's office a call or give me a call, and we'll help you make that decision and maybe even help you create a motion to bring those things outside. Of the regular open meeting that you're required.

So a thing you need to know about executive sessions is you go into these and they're not recorded. There's, um, you know, you can't take any action inside of them. You can discuss what you're going to do, and then only after you come out of executive session do you take any action. In other words, motions are done in open meeting, but the discussion and deliberations on executive session type subjects should all be done inside the executive session. So you have these constraints.

You're required to— to Open Meeting Act, you're required not to have small little meetings between the inappropriate size of people outside of a meeting, you know. So what's the remedy if you violate on this? Well, the remedy is essentially this, is that someone who is disgruntled with what the Border Commission did, they could take it to court and get that action voided. Of course, these concerns don't come up in front of boards and commissions that often because what you all know is most of your boards are advisory boards as opposed to action-based boards. And so you don't get yourself into that position where someone wants to avoidable, but you still need to give the Open Meetings Act its deserved respect and give the public its deserved rights by conducting your, your meetings in open under all the circumstances that they're required.

And if you don't, um, you could be subject to removal by the assembly as a board member because you're not holding your meetings in public, or you could be subject to court action that could void any action that you take under these circumstances.

Um, let me speak briefly to some circumstances under the Open Meetings Act that you need to think about so you don't violate the Open Meetings Act. Um, social gatherings— you go to a party or a music gathering or a, uh, some other social gathering and you run into, um, 3 or more members of your board or commission, that's not an Open Meeting Act. Those are, are things, um, all I could give you a warning on is that if you run into each, uh, your board at a social gathering don't huddle in the corner and have a meeting because then, then that would turn the social gathering into an open meeting act, you know.

A lunch meeting of less than 3 or less than a majority is, is not an open meeting. You can do that. You can sit down with 1, 1 or 2 members of your board and have lunch with them and talk about subjects, but as soon as you get up to 3 or, or a majority of your members, and it becomes a meeting.

There are circumstances when you can contact other members of your board or commission for scheduling purposes and, and the like that aren't considered Open Meeting Act, but I warn you, if you're going to take a vote on something, don't do a test, you know, what are you going to vote on and what are you going to vote on that, because that, if you get above the limit, that's going to be considered a meeting that could be subject to the Open Meetings Act. I think what we find as one of the bigger problems of implementation of making and making sure people don't violate the Open Meeting Acts, the Clerk's Office and myself see people use emails and texting and social media inappropriately to the point where they get themselves in trouble with the Open Meetings Act. So I would suggest you be very careful on that, that you not get yourself in a situation where you're replying to all, um, where you're sending out an email that, uh, or a text that asks for some kind of response to a number of members on your board or commission that would violate the Open Meetings Act. Because again, that turns into this serial communication that creates the problem. And we want to avoid this because we want the public to see what we do, everything that we do.

We don't want to do our deliberations, our discussions, or our voting in private. We want to do it all in public. That's my, um, all I have, uh, on the Open Meetings Act. Um, I'll take any questions you have either after I'm done, or you can contact me in private or send me an email as you desire. The next subject area would be conflicts of interest.

And what you need to know about conflicts of interest is that if you have a conflict, you shouldn't be discussing, deliberating, or voting on anything that the board is doing on that subject. But conflicts of interest are limited as far as what you have to conflict yourself out because as Melissa mentioned earlier, abstaining is not something that is allowed in our form of government. You have an obligation to vote and that's in our charter and in our code. And you can't just because you may have some bias or some tendency or some preconceived notion on things, that's not the reason for recusing yourself from a vote. It's only if you have an identifiable conflict of interest that allows you to disclose that, and then if the chair allows you to recuse yourself from a vote.

So let's talk about process first. Because process is really important when conflict of interest comes. If you go to a meeting and there's an agenda item and you believe you have a conflict of interest and should not be discussing, deliberating, or voting on a particular matter, you need to disclose that at the open meeting to the chair of the meeting. And when you do so, it is then the responsibility of the chair to decide whether or not it is a disqualifiable conflict of interest, and then you should then remove yourself from discussion, deliberation, and voting on that matter. Some people leave the table.

That's not required. Some people just sit there and just say, I'm— I just won't get involved. But that's the process that has to be followed, and to make really this Conflict of Interest Code work.

And let's talk about what is a conflict of interest here. And really, there's only one thing specified in our code, and that is if you have a substantial financial interest in that matter. That's the only code— or I call it codified conflict. And what is a substantial financial interest? Well, I don't suggest that there is a rule of thumb on the amount of money that you could be financially interested in.

I think it has to be decided on a case-by-case basis. You know, clearly if you only make a penny from some transaction that you have, it's probably not significant enough or substantial enough to conflict you. Some of my predecessors have put rules of thumb of $200 or $1,000 I just think you need to look at each one and look at the circumstances of why you're getting a financial interest in a subject and let the chair and the body decide if it's enough to be considered substantial. And it's not by just you. It's also by an immediate family member who lives in your house— household has a financial interest in it.

An immediate family member would be your wife, your husband, your children, maybe even your, your parents. And if they have a substantial financial interest, you could all— and then they live in your household, they could also be— this conflict could also exist.

Again, I emphasize procedure here. Procedure being that If you walk into this case and you say, oh, we're deciding something, and if I voted on this, this would affect my pocketbook or affect a family member's who lives with me pocketbook, you know, whatever it is, some advisory opinion that you're giving to the assembly or actually in the Planning Commission, some variance or some something, you know, that would actually affect the pocketbook of the member discussing, deliberating, and voting on it, members, then you need to disclose that conflict and ask the chair to decide whether or not you recuse from it, you know. Now that is the part of the code that is explicit about no substantial financial interests can be present if you're going to participate on a certain matter, but there are disqualifying biases and prejudices that you may want to disclose, that this isn't specified in our code, but common law tells us that if you have a bias or prejudice to the extent that you cannot discuss and deliberate and consider a matter, to the extent that you should be disqualified, you should mention that to the chair, saying that, hey, we're making a decision on this person or this entity or this subject that I, I can't reasonably, um, listen to the evidence on it or listen to the facts and make a reasonable decision. I am too biased, I am too prejudiced, therefore I should be disqualified. And if frankly that doesn't come up very often.

I mean, what happens a lot, we're in a small town, we're all related. Just because you know somebody or something or have connection with something doesn't automatically— and you have respect for that person or you or don't have respect for that person doesn't mean that you're automatically disqualified. You know how the way it is around here, everybody knows everybody, and if we all brought up those kind of connections we have in the community, we wouldn't be able to vote on anything. We wouldn't get any work done. So this is an extreme circumstance.

I would only suggest that you bring it up if you have such a close connection that has created a bias or prejudice that you have no ability to be reasonable. I don't think this will come up very often, if at all. I think the main ones, and that's why it's only codified— the only one codified is, is there a substantial financial interest that should be looked at by the chair and the body to see whether or not you recuse yourself.

One other point that I'd like to bring out about whether or not you have a substantial financial interest is sometimes you may have a financial interest, but you're part of an effective class that accepts you from being recused. I'll give you a couple of obvious examples. One that has happened just recently on the assembly where we have a, a teacher on the, the assembly, and the assembly was voting on the budget, and the, and the teacher disclosed the conflict, but the conflict wasn't substantial enough because the budget wasn't considering her salary. And the exception that applies to her anyways is that she's a part of a class of people, and that class being the other teachers and, uh, the other employees of the school district that are all treated equally. And under those circumstances people aren't required— when they are part of this class of people that are treated equally, they're not required to recuse themselves with voting on things.

I don't know what— if you'll have similar things come up with conflicts in boards or commissions, but that exception for being part of a class is something to consider. And what I would suggest is that if you're uncomfortable about a matter that's on the agenda for your board or commission meeting and you think that there might be a conflict, either because of a substantial financial interest that you might have or some other disqualifying bias or prejudice, give me a call beforehand and I'll, I'll process it with you and give you some advice, tell you how to disclose it, and tell you what I think would be the, the right result. And I get these all the time from assembly members, and sometimes from boards and commission members, and I encourage you to contact me if you need to process those things because we want people to participate and we don't want people, um, to, uh, believe that there's a conflict when there's not one. Okay, that's, uh, the second one. The third one I want to talk briefly about is what's called ex parte communications.

And this, what ex parte communications are, communications outside of board meetings with citizens who have, want to discuss with you, um, things that are being considered by your board or commission. And when you are acting as in your board of commission as a quasi-judicial body. Ex parte communications on that matter are prohibited. Let me try to explain that as simply as I can. Some of you boards and commissions, like the Planning Commission, um, and others, are put in circumstances where you have to make a decision on somebody's application.

And when you have to make that decision, you want to do so without being influenced outside of an open meeting by the people that is involved. So maybe let me give an example about the Planning Commission. Let's say someone has applied for a variance, and that person is— that variance is going to be heard by the Planning Commission. And a decision made on it at an upcoming meeting. And you're on the Planning Commission and the person who has applied for the variance comes up and talks to you or tries to talk to you about that application for the variance.

And what you need to know is that you're prohibited from talking to that person because it would put in jeopardy the decision if you were to, to then serve on the commission and make a decision on it. It would put in jeopardy that decision because you were potentially influenced outside of a public meeting. There was an ex parte communication that wasn't allowed and therefore puts at risk the decision. So what do you do if you're in a situation, you're on one of these boards or commissions, when you're put into the position of making a quasi-judicial decision? You have to make a vote on something and someone comes up and you just have to tell that person, are you talking to me on something about what's going to be heard at our next border commission.

If so, I need to stop you right here. I don't want to conflict myself. I'm not allowed to talk to applicants before we hear this, and I would encourage you to bring your points to the meeting and discuss it with us at that time. No reason you have to be rude or just be a matter of fact. And if they have a problem with that, heck, tell them to call me.

I'll talk to them about it. But we need to keep our meetings open. We need to make sure when we make decisions at that meeting related to applicants that there is not an unfair ability of applicants to present their case outside of the public meeting. And that's why we have to prohibit those ex parte communications. Well, that's a real brief rundown of those 3 topic areas.

I hope you will take this as an opportunity to understand when the red flags go up as far as what sometimes legal, um, points that you have to consider in exercising your, your duties as Board and Commission members. And I'm here to answer questions. Now, but I'll also— I'll repeat my encouragement for you to contact me by phone or email at any time to discuss any questions you have or any concerns you have about exercising your duties on the boards and commissions that you serve.

Melissa, anything else you think I need to cover? I think that's it. I guess we can open it up for Question? Sure.